NOI and Bible ... *PROOF that IamthatIam deleted his posts in The Lighthouse Forum

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NOI and Bible ... *PROOF that IamthatIam deleted his posts

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TroyX	NOI and Bible ... *PROOF that IamthatIam deleted his posts	Lead	[-]
Posts: 8 Jun 6 10 8:22 PM More My Recent Posts	Tags : None This debate is in response to a Youtube video, posted by user KeepitRealisrael, entitled "NOI vs Bible". I ask everyone to refrain from posting until he presents his arguments. Last Edited By: lighthouseali Jul 2 10 1:25 PM. Edited 3 times.
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PimpinTim		#1	[-]
Posts: 28 Jun 24 10 6:20 PM More My Recent Posts	Let's get this party started. Where do we need to begin? Just so I make this clear...Bible over all other BS.
lighthouseali		#2	[-]
Posts: 9623 Jun 26 10 9:02 AM Lighthouse Keeper More My Recent Posts	PTim, I thought "BS" was "Biblical Scripture". Perhaps, you meant "books of scripture". If that's the case, then I place the Bible over no other book of scripture. All books of scripture are worthy of my reading as they contain guiding principles and grains of truth in varying degrees. PTim, if you are not the person to whom Troy is referencing, then I ask that you refrain from commenting until said person makes his or her arguments. Peace. Ali Muhammad
lighthouseali		#3	[-]
Posts: 9623 Jun 26 10 9:03 AM Lighthouse Keeper More My Recent Posts	IamThatIam, am I to be graded on my knowledge and understanding of the NOI? LOL. Let's not examine MY understanding of NOI, but rather let us look into your understanding or even misunderstandings of NOI as you should have a case to claim according to the author of this thread. And on that note, in respect to the request of the author of this thread, I will take a seat until YOUR arguments are posted. "I ask everyone to refrain from posting until he presents his arguments." - Troy X Peace. Ali Muhammad
lighthouseali		#4	[-]
Posts: 9623 Jun 27 10 12:15 AM Lighthouse Keeper More My Recent Posts	"This is not flaming, but this is definitely fire..." - IamthatIam No, this is funny. That's what it is. LOL. You're just taking conjecture and posting it and you're not even posting it in a cohesive or coherent manner.
salihm		#5	[-]
Posts: 7 Jun 27 10 5:04 PM More My Recent Posts	"So he asked me to come here and post my same arguments"-IamthatIam Then you state... "So before I go into my arguments I would like to get some mature info... on your spiritual leaders"-IamthatIam So before you argue, you want to figure out what you're actually trying to argue? Come on now. If you have something to argue, then argue it. "Because based on "google" .."-IamthatIam If google is your source for information, you really have no place debating anyone. LOL, according to google this is salihm http://guildwars.wikia.com/wiki/Cursed_Salihm and that certainly not me. "It is commonly taught that in the Nation of Islam..." LOL, Is this according to your google search as well? "The second coming of Jesus.."-IamthatIam This must be according to your google search, huh? "it was claimed by Elijah Muhammad if anyone can prove that Wallace Ford was not God, and indeed have a full history on earth to come forward... And history tells that a woman came forward stating that she was the wife of his... I would love for you to address these statements first" This must be based on your google search too, huh? LOL. Peace. Salih Muhammad
salihm		#6	[-]
Posts: 7 Jun 27 10 9:20 PM More My Recent Posts	"Salih Muhammad if you had read up ^^^ you would have seen that this topic sprung from an existing debate NOI VS ISLAM from my youtube account (KEEPITREALISREAL) so if you really wanted to know some of my arguments you could have went there"-IamThatIam Hey buddy if YOU had read up you would have seen this, "I ask everyone to refrain from posting until he presents his arguments."-Troy X "Elijah teaches that..."-IamthatIam Is that a direct quote? Or is it your summarization? "What would you call someone that is black, who now rapes, robs and causes bloodshed? Would you call him a blood-shedder and a devil too?..." -IamthatIam Posing a question does not constitute presenting an argument. Again, "I ask everyone to refrain from posting until he presents his arguments."-Troy X Present an Argument. Then I will be very happy to begin answering your simple questions. Yo Brotha, Salih Muhammad
lighthouseali		#7	[-]
Posts: 9623 Jun 28 10 8:04 AM Lighthouse Keeper More My Recent Posts	"And questions are part of an Argument Einstein..." - IamthatIam Are you he who spoke of "real debates"? You need to present a premise, what you consider to be evidence and an explanation of how said evidence supports your premise. Everyone is waiting on you to present an argument. You might want to arrest us before trying to interrogate us and before attempting to arrest us, you may want to say "you are under arrest for the crime of...", but no, that would be too much like you making an opening statement, wouldn't it? Aside from that, no one (at these forums) seeks employment from you. No one is under this thread to be interviewed by you. You have no salary to offer us. Our reward is with our Lord, so how about you drop the interview process and proceed with your opening statements? Peace. Ali Muhammad
TroyX		#8	[-]
Posts: 8 Jun 28 10 9:13 AM More My Recent Posts	IamThatIam, Do you have a specific topic you would like to debate about? I'm not sure what I should be responding to.
lighthouseali		#9	[-]
Posts: 9623 Jun 28 10 10:17 AM Lighthouse Keeper More My Recent Posts	Troy, "IamthatIam" seems to have a problem formulating an argument while having a lust to argue after boldly offering commentary on "real debates". This is utterly laughable. "I am going to point out some things that he taught that is indeed wrong" - IamthatIam This is a bold declaration made, but IamthatIam has not presented evidence supporting anything as being wrong or even stated anything as being wrong. We're still waiting on.... 1. What is wrong ("This is wrong.....") 2. Why whatever is proposed to be wrong is proposed as wrong ("This is wrong because...") 3. How what is offered as evidence supports the premise This is the dude who spoke of "real debates"? Utterly laughable. ASA. Brother Ali
FARRAKHANLIGHT		#10	[-]
Posts: 8 Jun 28 10 10:09 PM More My Recent Posts	I do not see the big deal in being all technical as to answer the fellow questions. You said when Master Fard Muhammad father cast 7 devils out of his wife was that called reformation. My answer would be no He simply cast 7 devils out of his wife plain and simple. According to the lessons, it states that the prophets have tried and could not so they did not waste any more time and decided the devil would be better taken off of the earth and I fast and pray that this happens sooner than later. @LighthouseAli- Salaam Alaikum brother- I really do not think it is that serious to deal with the questions Let us just deal with them as they bring them out and put an end to their whole issue. I re-call debating with Christians in the barbershop and we did not ask them for premises etc. We just gave them the old fashion Muslim beat down. I myself do not know the formal way to argue per say. So let us compromise with this desperate brother and just give him the old fashion Muslim beat down. Any more questions @ IamthatIaim Salaam Alaikum!
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lighthouseali		#11	[-]
Posts: 9623 Jun 30 10 10:32 AM Lighthouse Keeper More My Recent Posts	"ARGUMENT: The NOI is contradictory and hypocritical" - IamthatIam No, we're not, but finally.............you have presented an argument. (Let's give IamthatIam a rousing round of applause.) "ARGUMENT CONTRADICTIONS IN THE NOI DOCTRINE" - IamthatIam Wait a minute. Let's retract that round of applause. Hit rewind. Note: We can do that because it was studio applause...LOL. Why has he re-written his "argument" and removed what he originally presented as an actual argument. "Contradictions in the NOI doctrine" is not an argument. Its not even a complete sentence, much less a declarative statement. Has anyone noticed that IamthatIam has an aversion to offering declarative sentences as arguments? "WHITE PEOPLE CANNOT DO GOOD" - IamthatIam Removing words from the greater body of writings allows you to reinterpret such words in most cases, but not on my watch. Who is the "they"? Does this plural pronoun "they" simply refer to "white people" as IamthatIam suggests or has the "they" been identified as referring to something very specific? If we go to Chapter 54 of Message to the Black man in America, we will see... http://www.seventhfam.com...ooks/black_man/blk54.htm "4 They (white race)" ...and even though number four numerically precedes number six, Mr. Muhammad did not wait to get to number four to clarify who the "they" was referencing. From the outset, he established who the "they" referenced, for in point number one we find... "-- the white race." So if we are to remain true to what Mr. Muhammad has presented, the assertion must read... "The white race cannot do good" However, he will find no quotes within Mr. Muhammad's teachings that directly contradict that statement. IamthatIam would have had a few more seconds* of limelight and it would have appeared that he found a DIRECT contradiction had he contrasted Chapter 17 of "Our Saviour Has Arrived" against the following quote... "They cannot love Allah and His religion Islam, for it is against their nature to submit to Allah, the Lord of the Worlds." but again, white individuals accepting Islam is not the white race accepting Islam. No contradiction. Whoa...Did Lighthouse Ali just shut down his "argument" without even touching the second statement? I don't do fast food, so small fries are easily discarded. "Conclusion: This is a contradiction within the NOI doctrine " - IamthatIam No, all we can conclude that IamthatIam's two statements are his and they contradict themselves. Peace. Ali Muhammad
salihm		#12	[-]
Posts: 7 Jun 30 10 10:48 AM More My Recent Posts	"I thought the Devil was the Caucasian race(Adam & Eve)" - IamthatIam "Conclusion: THE NOI DOCTRINE DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENSE!!!" IamthatIam's thoughts don't make any sense. Let's review that again... "I thought..." Stop right there. His thoughts, not Elijah Muhammad's thoughts. "Conclusion: THE NOI DOCTRINE DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENSE!!!" Correction: IamthatIam's thoughts do not make any sense. Sincerely, Salih Muhammad
TroyX		#13	[-]
Posts: 8 Jun 30 10 2:17 PM More My Recent Posts	IamThatIam, This is in response to your second "argument" since Lighthouseali already addressed your first one. You begin your conclusion statement with, "I thought the Devil was the Caucasian race(Adam & Eve)...". You then followed that up with your "matter of fact" final sentence of, "THE NOI DOCTRINE DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENSE!!!". Are you here to discuss actual Nation of Islam doctrine as taught by Elijah Muhammad or what you think ? If you are attempting to dispute the teachings of Elijah Muhammad, then you can't simply come with assumptions and use that to try and discredit the man and his teachings. Why? because then a conclusion can't be drawn from the end result of your erroneous thinking . You can't give your interpretation on something that you misunderstand and then want a response that satisfies such misunderstanding. Don't assign your understanding to us and then expect us to interpret your understanding based off of what you think.
IamThatIam		#14	[-]
Posts: 118 Jun 30 10 10:28 PM More My Recent Posts	I love how you guys disregarded everything I have posted... It is fine with me, because this will go on my channel lol@you... You are the ones who have to sleep with these questions over your head like an Angelic-Halo SMH! But "we" know why you cannot answer anything I have ever posted... Luke 21:15 [15] For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist. Oh and by the way, as far as your beliefs go; I don't think I have to tell that you (you=plural) are in nothing!!! I think you can truly see that for yourself... John 8:32 [32] And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
TroyX		#15	[-]
Posts: 8 Jul 1 10 7:39 AM More My Recent Posts	IamThatIam, No one has disregarded anything you've said. There won't be a defense mounted up against your skewed understanding of what you think Elijah Muhammad's teachings mean. Why? Because then this will become a game of "catch me if you can!" and that's not going down. You started your conclusion with "I thought the Devil was the Caucasian race(Adam & Eve)...". By starting your sentence with what you think, you are already admitting that there's room for error, misunderstanding, and you don't have full knowledge of what you're speaking of. Because we realize this, we have decided not to entertain your second question. It would be like the equivalent of me saying, "I thought 6(4)+7=2!.....your math doesn't make sense!". Do you see how a conclusion and understanding wouldn't be able to be drawn from one trying to defend the product of that equation? Had you known what you were talking about and posed your comment in a matter of fact tone and stated, perhaps, "The Nation of Islam says..." or "Elijah Muhammad teaches...if he said....then how come....." then you would see a different response....BUT, you've already admitted to not having a firm grasp of understanding by giving us your thoughts. Would you like to try again?
lighthouseali		#16	[-]
Posts: 9623 Jul 1 10 3:53 PM Lighthouse Keeper More My Recent Posts	A word on cowards... "Only a coward would keep making up excuses..." - IamthatIam Excuse #1 - "*I want to know what you know and understand about the NOI" - IamthatIam This is an excuse not to debate. Excuse #2* - "*before I go into my arguments I would like to get some mature info... on your spiritual leaders" - IamthatIam This is an excuse not to debate. Excuse #3* - "*if you really wanted to know some of my arguments you could have went there" - IamthatIam This is an excuse not to debate. Excuse #4* - "*I am "KEEPITREALISRAEL" from you tube... So it is ok for you to answer the questions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And questions are part of an Argument Einstein" - IamthatIam This is an excuse not to debate. Excuse #5* - "if you cannot answer the question, then remove yourself from the discussion and we will wait " - IamthatIam This is an excuse not to debate. Excuse #6 - "A topic? are you serious???????????? " - IamthatIam This is an excuse not to debate. Excuse #7 - "QUESTION....." - IamthatIam This is a diversionary tactic used to avoid debating. Excuse #8 - "You are the ones who have to sleep with these questions over your head like an Angelic-Halo SMH!" - IamthatIam This is a diversionary tactic used to avoid debating. We've been given no statements declaring our theology as wrong. We've only been presented with questions which conviently leave IamthatIam with no position to defend. He does not want to debate. He does not want to engage in point-counter-point. He wants to ask questions...LOL. This is indeed a cowardly move. He was given ample opportunity to debate. Opportunity #1 - "*I ask everyone to refrain from posting until he presents his arguments." - Troy X (06/06/10 20:22:10) Opportunity #2* - "*in respect to the request of the author of this thread, I will take a seat until YOUR arguments are posted." - Lighthouse Ali (06/26/10 09:03:53) Opportunity #3* - "*Come on now. If you have something to argue, then argue it.* " - Salihm (06/27/10 17:04:58) Opportunity #4 - "*Present an Argument." - Salihm (06/27/10 21:20:48) Opportunity #5* - "*You need to present a premise, what you consider to be evidence and an explanation of how said evidence supports your premise." - Lighthouse Ali (06/28/10 08:04:22) Opportunity #6* - "*IamThatIam, Do you have a specific topic you would like to debate about*?" - Troy X (06/28/10 09:13:44) Opportunity #7 - "We're still waiting on....1. What is wrong ("This is wrong.....") 2. Why whatever is proposed to be wrong is proposed as wrong ("This is wrong because...") 3. How what is offered as evidence supports the premise" - Lighthouse Ali (06/28/10 10:17:11) After giving SEVEN (7) excuses not to make a declarative statement, after being given SEVEN (7) opportunities to present a premise, he says writes "NOI is contradictory and hypocritical", BUT HE DELETES THAT POST and REPLACES IT with "CONTRADICTIONS IN THE NOI DOCTRINE". Afterwards, he makes another COWARD move and takes quotes out of context and projects his inferences as our NOI arguments, but his inference is UTTERLY proven wrong and this is what he feared all along. He now acts as though his post was not addressed.** More on cowardly behavior... IamthatIam has deleted several of his posts. A man would stand by what he types while a coward would delete his posts that make him look like an idiot. See page one and the quotes that Salih posted. IamthatIam deleted the posts which contained the quotes. Will IamthatIam pull another cowardly move and act as though he never typed his words that were quoted? You be the judge. LOL. Ali Muhammad
IamThatIam		#17	[-]
Posts: 118 Jul 1 10 5:18 PM More My Recent Posts	Can the Devil do good? http://www.seventhfam.com...ooks/black_man/blk54.htm The Message of the Black man / Truth of Guilty Made Known” Paragraph 6 They were not created to love respect any member of the darker nations, for they are by nature, as Almighty Allah has taught them, in capable of loving even themselves. Paragraph 7 They cannot produce good, for they are without the nature of good... Note: WHITE PEOPLE CANNOT DO GOOD http://www.seventhfam.com...ur_saviour/saviour17.htm Our Savior has Arrived / A Few White People are Muslims by Faith Paragraph 3 There are quite a few white people in America who are Muslim by faith. Good done by any person is rewarded and these white people who believe in Islam will receive the Blessing of entering into the Hereafter. We have "two" conflicting statements here. One says the Devil cannot do good and the other the Devil can do good. CONTRADICTION!!!
IamThatIam		#18	[-]
Posts: 118 Jul 1 10 5:21 PM More My Recent Posts	CAN THE DEVIL BE REFORMED? SUPREME WISDOM LESSON BOOK/ V. LOST-FOUND MUSLIM LESSON NO. 2 http://www.thenationofislam.org/muslimlessontwo.html 34. And can you reform devil? ANS. No. All the prophets have tried to reform him (devil), but were unable. (According to the teachings of Elijah Muhammad, the devil CANNOT BE REFORMED Source---> http://www.allahteam.info/masterfard.htm CAN THE DEVIL BE REFORMED? Contradictory Statement... Fard's mother was a Caucasian woman from the mountains of Asia. This woman is supposed to have been raised since the age of six under the Islamic Sharia or Law in Mecca, Arabia. Her family was said to have been Muslim. She was taken through a "purification" process so that she could bare this child. This is the woman that the Bible says had the "seven devils" cast out of her. Her name was reportedly Baby Gee. She was specially prepared to give birth to this Special Son. (The following quote was transcribed from a video-taped lecture of the 1973 Saviour's Day Lecture) (http://www.muhammadspeaks.com/news.html) This Caucasian female who is suppose to be of a race of Devil's (according to the teachings of Elijah Muhammad) has been purified. I do not care whether it was by way of casting 7 devils or ABRACADABRA! The fact that she has been PURIFIED!!! means that she has reformed.
IamThatIam		#19	[-]
Posts: 118 Jul 1 10 5:25 PM More My Recent Posts	Is Adam & Eve a race of Devil's or the Righteous? (Http:/www.thenationofislam.org/muslimlessontwo.html) THE SUPREME WISDOM LESSONS/ V. LOST-FOUND MUSLIM LESSON NO. 2 33. What is devil? ANS. A grafted man which is made weak and wicked. Or, any grafted, live germ from the original is a devil. Note: A devil is a grafted man http://www.seventhfam.com...ooks/black_man/blk55.htm The Message to the Black man / V. The Making of the Devil Paragraph 90 In the days of Yakub's grafting of the present white race, a new and unalike race... paragraph 98 The Yakub made devils were really pale white, with really blue eyes; Note: A grafted man is the White Race http://www.seventhfam.com...ooks/black_man/blk62.htm The Message to the Blackman / The White Race’s false claim to be Divine, Chosen people Paragraph 1 According to the Bible (Gen. 3:20-24), Adam and his wife were the first parents of all people (white race only) and the first sinners. Note: Adam and Eve are Caucasian http://www.seventhfam.com...ooks/black_man/blk58.htm The Message to the Black man / The Beast Part 2 Paragraph 1 God and His Prophets could not have given the white race a better name (serpent) according to the characteristics of that race. The serpent of Genesis 3:1 was none other than the devil (white race). He deceived Adam and his wife, causing them to disobey Allah (God), which was the plan of the serpent (devil), according to the history of the devils. Their greatest desire is to make the righteous disobey the law of righteousness. Note: The devil deceived Adam and Eve (The righteous) How can the devil deceive Adam & Eve who in turn are the devil themselves; since they are part of the Caucasian race, who is grafted and grafted people are the devil?
IamThatIam		#20	[-]
Posts: 118 Jul 1 10 5:31 PM More My Recent Posts	There you go boys have fun with those questions... LOL smiley faces
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NOI and Bible ... *PROOF that IamthatIam deleted his posts

NOI and Bible ... *PROOF that IamthatIam deleted his posts